Lindsay! Now to read!

Quite simply, the electorate doesn’t trust John McCain to handle the economy. And why should they?

none at all.

but that doesn’t mean i trust obama either. obama has the intellectual ability to “get” it - but does he? or has he created a circle of neoliberal ideologists for his economic advisors?

Given McCain’s tenous grasp of all things economic, I’m hardly surprised.

There are visceral issues for American voters. High gas prices are one. Paulson’s demand for $700 billion to bail out his buddies and screw homeowners is another. Voters understand that this is a Republican thing and McCain suffers accordingly. In addition, voters generally move toward Democrats in times of economic crisis.

Thank goodness there are some people in America paying attention besides us.

How long before McCain claims that during his years as a POW he thought mostly about economic issues?

This is true not just of Obama but Dodd, Franks, and the other Congressional Democrats.

the fundamentals?

Yes, he’s always been concerned about the workers.

The SC-R congressman saying even if Wall Street panicks, the government shouldn’t panick as well. good point.

FYI, Froomkin WaPo chat @ noon http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....02504.html

monitor is drenched. 707!

All I know is that it’s pretty sad when a pop star has such an obviously better grasp of world affairs and how to fix world problem spots than candidates for the Presidency and VP.

We win when the election is about issues the GOP wins when the election is about gossip.

good point. sanders seems pretty good on this issue though.

or anything outside of ‘issues’

Isn’t Sanders an independent?

Isn’t Sanders a socialist?

yes, but he caucuses with the Ds

Sorry, that #18 was meant to be a reply to wobblybits at #17.

a bit OT but per Daily Kos

The conservative Republican counterproposal to the bailout is, of course… to banish all capital gain taxes, so that rich people can save us by “selling their unwanted assets.” Um… WTF?

here is what they are proposing

Two-Year Suspension of the Capital Gains: Immediately suspend the capital gains rate from 15% for individuals and 35% for corporations. By encouraging corporations to sell unwnated assets, this provision would unleash funds and materials with which to create jobs and grow the economy. After the two-year suspension, capital gains rates would return to present levels but assets would be indexed permanently for any inflationary gains.

Bush/McCain’s only card to play now is a do nothing congress won’t give Sec Paulson all that cash with no strings attached Now!
Like Bush/McCain wants them to so if the market goes down more between now and election day it will be the Dems fault.
This tactic would have worked except that the voters don’t seem to trust the GOP anymore on the economy.
They trust Obama more, they don’t trust Paulson’s plan, so we should not rush to approve this crap.
If anything the market will go down nomatter what we do now nobody trusts the banks books.

i don’t know but I know he isn’t a dem. as Selise says, he caucuses witht he dems. I listen to him on Tom hartman’s show on Fridays. it is an excellent weekly segment

Probably the best thing McCain could do to improve his chances is to disappear for the next 6 weeks.

Digg it here.

forgot to add this part by the poster

Am I missing something? You don’t pay capital gains on something you’ve lost money on, so capital gains tax doesn’t apply to any of the “toxic” assets in question.

I don’t trust so called financial experts who know how to structure a deal so complicated no one can understand it (thereby making them the “experts” to explain how they are going to hose you and make you feel good about it happening) and they know how to sell this crap.

Their ploys boil down to Buy Now! Don’t delay! Exclusive offer to Taxpayers only! If you act now, you can avoid disaster! We’ll also throw in the bonus set of “regulations” on how we want you to play our game!

Ok that plan would cost us money in lost tax revenue and increased interest on the National Debt with interest rates headed up. Also we tried Bush cutting taxes to boost the economy for years and the DOW is when inflation is factored in a flatline or a loss depending on the day.
Does anyone in the GOP read?

the proposals we’re looking at are not multi-thousand page complicated deals. they are just a few pages of few words. doesn’t take much to say “blank check”

You know what would create new jobs and grow the economy? A huge increase in demand for medical products and services if healthcare was universal. Invest in a new healthcare infrastructure ala the New Deal, put people back to work, and increase the tax base and revenue. Voila!

can he atleast come put for the debates? Grant it, i’ll miss the one on friday but I’ll be around for the other two

Given McCain’s tenous grasp of all things economic, I’m hardly surprised.

Why limit it to things economic? His foreign policy/security credentials are shall we say, vastly overstated, although I heard a rumor that he might just possibly have been a POW, which of course would change everything.

the one thing the dems have that makes them look good - is the insanity of the relublicans.

I still don’t know what their proposal has to do with the present situation. So to answer your question, no they don’t read or comprehend.

The Congressional Budget Office is saying in testimony that it is impossible to tell if $700B will be enough.

I liked how Chris Shays referred to the Bush Proposal as a “No-Doc Bailout.”

Long live King George (this is exactly what the British wanted in 1776 - American subjugation to the powerful).

LOL

707

http://www.bartcop.com/paulson-licking.jpg

BTW, I thought I heard Todd this morning on MSNBC talking about them having a new poll coming out later today also.

agreed

Lincoln Davis doing a great job of calling BS

love it, lots of talk about pigs, slaughter, hogs, bacon. Barney Frank says “now we’re getting into religious matters!”

Per the same post (it just keeps getting better /s)

The other parts of this “alternative plan”? Completely privatize Freddie and Fannie, revoking their charters and turning them into normal (though massive) private mortgage companies. Suspend the accounting principles that state companies must mark their assets at their estimated current worth, as opposed to their theoretical worth in other circumstances — that one has been a major demand of the large companies with lots of credit default swap holdings. And to stablize the dollar, “repeal the Humphrey-Hawkins Full Employment Act.”
That last one is especially baffling, because as I understand it the Humphrey-Hawkins act expired in 2000. Unless I’m missing something, the only current thing that could be considered colloquially “Humphrey-Hawkins” is the mandate that the chairman of the Federal Reserve give twice-yearly reports on the state of the economy and monetary policy; surely that can’t be what they’re objecting to, so what the hell is it?

HA

Only if he promises to remove one of his Ferragamos and use it to pound the lectern, ala Nikita Khrushchev, to whom he bears a striking resemblance.

McShame does know some things about the economy
Great ad
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/....._0923.html

although I heard a rumor that he might just possibly have been a POW

You don’t say? I’ve not heard that.

What a modest guy. If I was running for office, I’d surely bring it up.

Well right. but we’re supposed to take their word that that is what’s needed cuz they are so sophisticated and we’re not. that’s what I’m chafing at.

your killing me lol

New Marcy post

Oh, here is the link to the actual alternative bailout plan by the Republican Study Committee (RSP)

Bogus questions! I wonder what response they would get with a legitimate question: Which candidate would you rather have a beer with?

Those results would tell you who will likely win in November.

My sister and father believe Obama is a Muslim. My mother fears he is the antichrist (because she made the supreme error of reading the stupid-ass “Left Behind” books and taking them to heart even though she otherwise prefers Obama to McInsane). My retired military eldest sister…who knew BEFORE McInsane picked Palin as running mate, but for her, being a strong advocate for wolves and wildlife, the Palin pick was enough to queer any chance of voting for McInsane.

At least we can be certain he isn’t preparing to embark on the patented Palin/Wolfowitz hair-styling maneuver.

Hmm I don’t think most would want tohave a beer with McCain. What would we talk about? POW experiences? The 13 houese we all have?

Two-Year Suspension of the Capital Gains: Immediately suspend the capital gains rate from 15% for individuals and 35% for corporations. By encouraging corporations to sell unwnated assets, this provision would unleash funds and materials with which to create jobs and grow the economy. After the two-year suspension, capital gains rates would return to present levels but assets would be indexed permanently for any inflationary gains.

Just mind boggling! We’re staring into the abyss of financial meltdown (of mostly their creation, btw) and all they can come up with is shoveling more cash to the rich.

I hope these greedy, self serving a-holes get the Democratic landslide they deserve.

I wont watch the debate…don’t need to in order to inform or drive my vote. There is an absolutely zero percent chance I would EVER vote for McInsane and I already know where I strongly disagree with Obama on foreign policy (ie, expand the war in Afghanistan, leave residual troops in Iraq, continue the Clinton-style foreign policy which means cruise missiles up the ying-yang for any uppity countries that resist our economic desires). The three things I will be interested post-debate are: 1) Will it be noted that McInsane has a mysterious “hump”?; 2) Does he stroke out at some point of the debate?; and 3) What the general perception is as per the performance of each candidate after the fact.

True, but the guys…LOOK at Palin’s rack!

It is just one of those tricks. They KNOW it is a tough sell to bring back a “temporary suspension” of taxes because as the time approaches for the temporarily suspended/reduced tax to expire, they will argue that “the Dems are going to raise taxes again!” Same shit with the Bush tax cuts. They are set to expire so the GOPers jump on this expiration as a tax increase by the Dems.

LOL well if tits actually drove votes, me thinks we would have had a female pres by now

mysterious hump?? first I’ve heard about that.

i’m no lawyer or economist. but the proposals are so short - and so obviously lacking, that even i can see some of hte problems.

I simply wonder if McInsane will avail himself of the same mysterious hump that Bush did in his debates in 2004. Will it be a defibrillator? A communication device so that answers can be fed to him? Remember, the very same clowns that ran Bush are also running McInsane.

house financial services committee is in recess until 2:30 (i think), at which time the P&B show will commence.

gotcha. will someone be checking Plain’s updo ?

if tits actually drove votes, me thinks we would have had a female pres by now

Unless all those old white guys won because the electorate digs saggy man boobs.

The American home mortgage market has a face value of $12 trillion. It is likely to lose 40% of this value. That is some $4.8 trillion in losses that have to be apportioned out between homeowners and financial institutions. So yes, $700 billion might not be enough. Indeed it is something of a mystery number. I have not seen a good explanation how it was arrived at.

Easily fixed with a good “manzierre”. I believe all the old men who are anybody wear them.

They are choosing a number that they feel can be sustained, but requiring the total destruction of all the remaining New Deal programs and other niceties while still allowing huge-assed military spending. They can’t totally zero out the federal government. They have to pay for 750+ military bases, missile defense bullshit, replacement cruise missiles, a bigger army, two wars (and counting), and facing down Russia in a new Cool War (but DON’T call it a “Cold War”!).

At any rate, we’ve got Biden on the ticket to provide man-boob parity. At Obama’s VP unveiling in Springfield (IL), Biden jogged a few steps on his way to the lectern. Not the most dignified gait for a 65-year old guy wearing a dress shirt.

That is some $4.8 trillion in losses that have to be apportioned out between homeowners and financial institutions.

That assumes all of the 40% loss of value (which may or may not happen) is realized, which it won’t be, since everyone with a mortgage is not gonna sell precisely at the bottom and realize that loss.

At some point housing will turn around, and values will rise again.

Thank you for saying that; it is exactly right!

He SHOULD have done a Jack Palance and dropped and done a few one-armed push-ups.

Would have impressed me but they’ve already got my vote.

I know John doesn’t know much about numbers, but these should definitely give him some to crunch. A couple of weeks ago when Obama fell behind, I had friends who no longer believed in polls. I did and I do.

McCain is too damned old and angry and, as it now appears, dishonest to be handling the economy. And even the ”low-information” voters are beginning to get it. Hope this continues.

#7, you are a bad and funny man. Thanks for my laugh of the day. He hasn’t been playing the POW card as often, and I’m waiting for the next round of flag-waving patriotism to remind us.

Is anyone but me amused by the ad in which McCain sucks up to middle America by saying that the American worker is the best on earth. If that is true, why did he not work a little harder to keep American manufacturing jobs here? Talk is cheap when you are running for office.

My brand-new Whirlpool refrigerator is a piece of junk, and the repair guy who put the new part on the second refrigerator in a month, said that it’s because there is no quality control and the problem with the refrigerators has been going on for 4 years. All made in China. I would have paid more for one built here, but there are none or few.

I blame John McCain directly for my refrigerator problems. My toungue is only partially in my cheek on this one.

Talk is cheap, so by using it McCain gets the most bang from his campaign buck. Honesty from the McCain camp would be a rare and precious commodity. If he possesses any (doubtful), he evidently intends to unveil it at a later date.

I suspect everyone has moved to a more recent thread. I have errands and will bbl.

Wonder if that could be what’s wrong with my Whirlpool Dishwasher. My house burned down in 2003, so the insurance treated me to a new one, as well as a new stove and refrig. No problems with the stove or refrig, but nothing but problems with the dishwasher. Not big things, small stuff, but I am not pleased. Also, do all dishwashers take upwards of 2 hours to do a load of dishes? I don’t remember any of my others taking that long!

Spencer has a new thread up at Attackerman!

My 25-year-old dishwasher takes about 35 minutes to wash and another 15 in the dry/warming stage. Maybe yours is set for some superfluous stages such as preheating the water, which probably isn’t necessary since I gather your water heater is also fairly new.

Sorry to hear about your fire. My parents lost all their possessions in a fire before I was born, I know it can be devastating even if your losses are limited to things that can be easily replaced.

No preheating I don’t think, but 2 hrs. seems excessive under almost any scenario.

If you still have the manual it might tell you how long a cycle should take. If not, perhaps call or check the manufacturer’s website.

Good idea, I’ll try that! Did I also mention that I am having some problems with the thing you put the soap in. Not all the soap gets used; part of it stays in the soapdish and hardens. This thing operates, but I was used to quality with Whirlpool and I’m not getting quality with this thing! That’s the main problem.

Had the same problem with the soap. Ended up having to replace the inflow valve, or it might have been the water pump, it’s been awhile. Anyway, if it’s not letting in enough water to rinse out the soap tray, that would be my guess. I’m guessing it’s no longer under warranty?

That’s why I haven’t even tried to have it fixed! Can’t afford to. Just do dishes by hand first.

Yeah, now that I live alone I wash most of mine by hand, undoubtedly saves on electricity too.

At some point housing will turn around, and values will rise again.

Entirely true but when and how fast?